Lost your password? Please enter your email address. You will receive a link and will create a new password via email.
Please briefly explain why you feel this question should be reported.
Please briefly explain why you feel this answer should be reported.
Please briefly explain why you feel this user should be reported.
When an american civil war Lieutenant develops friendship with Lakota indians, he has to stand against his army to preserve his new way of life. – Dance with Wolves
moviefreak81:I want to thank you for posting for this film because it gave me the impetus to do some further brooding over the nature of the midpoint plot pivot.But first , let me respond to? the issue you raised>>he might feel his life is in danger,.. but is he really?The protagonist, Lt. JohRead more
moviefreak81:
I want to thank you for posting for this film because it gave me the impetus to do some further brooding over the nature of the midpoint plot pivot.
But first , let me respond to? the issue you raised
>>he might feel his life is in danger,.. but is he really?
The protagonist, Lt. John Dunbar, certainly thinks he is. And the young Lakota warriors initially want to kill him. But cooler heads prevail among the tribal elders. Because he is an United States soldier, the elders fear if that they kill him outright, it will provoke a retaliation against the whole tribe.
But, Dunbar doesn?t know that. So he takes every measure he can to prepare for an attack. (And while he is well provisioned, eventually his supplies will run out ? then what will he do to survive?)
Maybe a better logline is:
(27 words)
Now then.
The standard description of the midpoint (among other things) is that it is the moment in the story where the protagonist achieves a ?false victory?. He thinks he?s solved his dramatic problem, has achieved is objective goal or is well on his way.
And then things fall apart. His fortunes are reversed.
Two examples:
?L.A. Confidential? ? at the midpoint of the story the primary protagonist, Sgt. Edmund Exley, thinks he has achieved his objective goal, has solved the case of the ?Nite Owl Massacre?.
And then he discovers he hasn?t.
?The Martian? ? at the midpoint of the story, astronaut Mark Watney has resourcefully accomplished all he can to survive on Mars until he?s rescued ?his objective goal.
And then the airlock is breached. He loses all his potatoes plants. Now, he may not live long enough for the rescue mission to arrive.
In both these films, in spite of the midpoint reversal, the objective goal remains the same.
But in ?Dances with Wolves?, that does not seem to be the case. By midpoint, Dunbar has solved his dramatic problem. He has achieved his objective goal of ending hostilities with the Lakota. He?s so successful he?s been able to ?go native?, to fully assimilate into the tribe.
Then his fortune flips.
Not as the result of a discovery (?L.A. Confidential?). Not because of an accident (?The Martian?).
[Nor, btw, because of some ?character flaw that he hasn?t owned up to and overcome. On the contrary, Dunbar seems to have resolved his dramatic need by the midpoint, to have found peace of mind with the Lakota.]
Rather, Dunbar?s fortune flip is a matter of irony, because of the historical context of the story (well foreshadowed), the inevitable, encroachment of hordes of European settlers. By irony I mean:
After an army officer makes peace and joins the Indian tribe he was supposed to fight, he must make war against his own people to save his adopted tribe.
(29 words)
Indeed, for me this is the story hook.??And maybe it work as a logline.
A logline framed around around the midpoint?
But?but? I know,? I know.
Two points for your consideration:
1] I have come to believe that the most important element in a logline is a strong story hook.
2] Karel Seger in? a YouTube video mentions in passing that it?s nice to include a midpoint beat. But, of course, that is rarely possible given the word limit constraints.
I suggest this is a case where it is not only possible ? but perhaps necessary because, once again, I think the ironical twist is the story hook.
And if it?s doesn?t qualify as a bona fide logline, well, it?s my candidate for a teaser.
Just bloviating, brainstorming here. No firm conclusions or definitive answers.
fwiw
As a giant asteroid hurtles toward Earth, an embittered doomsday prepper must choose whether to open up his shelter to his runaway ex-wife and her crazy cult friends or risk spending eternity alone.
>>>after giving shelter to his runaway wifeOh, well,? that casts? loglining the plot in a whole new light.? It's need-to-know info.? The first version gives the impression that she's on the outside with the cultists trying to get it in. ("...whether to open up his shelter to his runaway ex-Read more
>>>after giving shelter to his runaway wife
Oh, well,? that casts? loglining the plot in a whole new light.? It’s need-to-know info.? The first version gives the impression that she’s on the outside with the cultists trying to get it in. (“…whether to open up his shelter to his runaway ex-wife”)
>>?not realizing she?s a double agent
Setting up the expectation of a? midpoint reveal/reversal/plot twist.? Normally that is not included in a logline.? For the sake of brevity.? In this instance, adding that reversal/twist extends the logline length from 27 words to 34 — which is tolerable.? And it may work as? a story hook –? an element that makes industry folk want to read the script to see how it plays out.
fwiw
See lessAs a giant asteroid hurtles toward Earth, an embittered doomsday prepper must choose whether to open up his shelter to his runaway ex-wife and her crazy cult friends or risk spending eternity alone.
I think Valentin's review is an improvement.It occurs to me that the more interesting and certainly more desperate character is the ex-wife.? All the guy has to do is ... well, very little.? He's safe and secure in the shelter, well-provisioned to wait out the disaster.? All he has to do is open theRead more
I think Valentin’s review is an improvement.
It occurs to me that the more interesting and certainly more desperate character is the ex-wife.? All the guy has to do is … well, very little.? He’s safe and secure in the shelter, well-provisioned to wait out the disaster.? All he has to do is open the door — or not.
In contrast,? she is in imminent danger of dying — she’s the character with the higher stakes, greater peril.? She’s pounding on the door, begging, pleading with him to let her and her fellow cultists in.? She would seem to be the more urgently, frantically proactive character.
fwiw
See less